Sudden Loss of Power Steering

Something strange happened today as I was driving off after giving my ride a shower.

Was leaving the wash bay down the slope of ths MSCP when I found I could not turn the wheel. Realizing something was absolutely wrong, I quickly applied brakes and checked my six before reversing back to the wash bay. Once stopped, I turned of the ignition, waited a while before starting the car again. Guess what, everything was back to normal and driving around with no further problems on my steering wheel.

Anybody can advise whether, is this normal for cars with electric power steerng? What had happened to cause the loss of power steering?

Guess I'll be checking in my car for a check to be safe. You guys all be careful and be aware when driving off.

oops... sorry, I think posted in wrong area.... paiseh.... can help to move this post to into General Discussions..? thanks

wa lau .... sound scary ...

I just wonder how you reversed back to washing bay when u couldn't turn the steering wheel. Did i understand u correctly ?

u heard me right lah koayst bro.... I parked in the washing bay aligned with the slope going down mah. So its actually the only option for me. I cannot turn either ways when I reached the bottom of the slope. I had to reverse back to where I started off.

did u turn ur ignition to on position without starting ur engine when u washing ur car? (eg to listen to music)

I did turn it on but for using the battery to power my portable water jet. Did that cause the incident? Why leh?

hmmmm next time u start ur car try letting the ecu run throught all the electronics first before u start... i believe urs is a EPS assist steering?

Divine wrote:hmmmm next time u start ur car try letting the ecu run throught all the electronics first before u start... i believe urs is a EPS assist steering?

must like that one ah? is that a flaw in the system ?

I'm kinda afraid it might be a flaw too.... if as what bro divine say, then it shud not happen when one is driving halfway in the expressway or what.... can't imagine the sudden loss of power steering when you are going in or out of the expressway at speed.

Ok, 2 contributory factor is
1) ECU not kick-in fully; and
2) also maybe I drained the battery too much.

I'll monitor again to see if I could simulate the problem next time I wash my car.

Any other expert opinions will be most welcome.

I encounter strange thing to my car be4.. but never to the stage of driving of with the steeling not working...

Just that everytime wash car... on battery and listen to radio.. then after that straight start engine.. I can feel the car is behaving differently...

so what I do is I will off everything... step brake to reset everything think mostly reset my alarm...

then turn and start engine...

Think so.. with most moden car.. electronics.. its always good to let the ECU check thru all the necessary module.. steering, ESC, engine etc... before.. start.. once running.. believe there should be some fail safe mode in place.. (some one could verify this?) i.e steering even w/o power can still steer the car.. although heavy..

looks like we cant really rush to run the car.. heard some toyo** model (IST) need certain idle time (like ~>5mins) before could drive away..

As long as this does not happen while driving...

Imagine this happening while one of the bros testing the top speed.

this leads me to another q.

when the engine not start, could we manually turn the wheel? (even if its v.very heavy?) or will we break anything.....

another case huh?
this sounds like the same issue from what my fren's wife encountered.. refer to thread "EPS light on"

This sound scary:eeek:. Can our electrical steering change to hydrolic type?

Yup.. EX comes with hydraulic steering.. no too worry, here it seems if car not start for a prolong period.. the module cut off the power supply to steering... to conserve power.. (i think for most modern car will be using motor / wire drive liao)

but i do concern if no assisted power (as specs indicated) could we turn / steer the car.. (just like hydraulic.. we could still do tat..)..

anyone? Thanks in advance..
else i post up when i got my ride.. in 2 weeks time. (i hope and finger cross...)

This sounds like what I experience before. Steering very heavy and feels lock.Unable to turn. Going for my servicing on Fri. Will check it out and see what could be the reason.

this seems to be a common problem now...

it better not..
Duser u mean unable to turn? oh.. that worrying. then.. but i thought the MDPS is assisting only.. not by wire (complete detach mechanism?)

1 imp question, this only happens when the drive just start the car right?

Anyone encountered this while driving halfway?

NOrmally when i turn the key, I will just let the ecu run for few sec and some of the indicator signs will go off then i crank the engine. This EPS thing, does not occur to me while driving on road. More on stationery. My wife experience one more time while moving from standstill at carpark two days ago. mY first case also from carpark ( Car switch on running with aircon about 6mins and then steering feels heavy and locked).

I shudder to think this will happen while driving, which I hopefully expect it not to happen.

I also think this one better not pray pray.... so I got an appointment to go in tomorrow morning to get it checked out.

Update everyone after.

Meanwhile, I still see a certain pattern. Which is, that this only so far happens when moving off.

I think i experience it once too. The EPS symbol lighted up and I was quite puzzled. I shut down the engine and restarted and everything was back to normal. Didnt happen again and i brushed it off as a one off thing. Hmm.. seems like quite a number of us are getting it eh.

duncton wrote:I also think this one better not pray pray.... so I got an appointment to go in tomorrow morning to get it checked out.

Update everyone after.

Meanwhile, I still see a certain pattern. Which is, that this only so far happens when moving off.

Do update us!

Juz to confirm.

This is happening to the SX only or the EX as well?

1.6 or 2.0?

hi, all after some checking..

here some finding..
its actually just assisted power.. so should still steer even when no power although its damn heavy... seeing the shafts connecting all the way to the steering drive...

joepele wrote:Juz to confirm.

This is happening to the SX only or the EX as well?

1.6 or 2.0?

this should be for all MDPS..

Btw.. also it seems to happen only during initial start of engine.. ? check not complete/ interrupt?

Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u got strong arms to control all the way down lol

tish wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u got strong arms to control all the way down lol

I used to drive cars without power steering, it's not much of a deal really.

Fortec wrote:

tish wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u got strong arms to control all the way down lol

I used to drive cars without power steering, it's not much of a deal really.

You also somehow disclosed your age.

hahahaha...........

Haaa..thanks bro fortec..

at least we can confirm... if power assist fail.. we could still manage to steer..and in drive..could save our as** it should not be tat heavy (but still heavy)... so 1 worry down.

so.. please turn hard if needs be.. it wont spoil anything.. ya.. ?

Fortec wrote:

tish wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u got strong arms to control all the way down lol

I used to drive cars without power steering, it's not much of a deal really.

ohh i not sure about EPS without electrical, used to drive a powerless steering starlet, only parking gives me problem coz its hard to turn wheels when car not moving.

So forte without electricity is the same as those none power steering ?

I would say no. I used to drive a suzuki swift sedan 9 yrs ago. It does not have power steering. So what I felt that day was different. It was much too stiff that day in my opinion.

Anyway, I called my SE today to see whether he's heard of such issues from any of his customers. In fact he said he experienced the same problem with his 2 ltr Forte. According to him, he sent it in for troubleshooting and their diagnosis was a loose valve. Tighten oredi and it did not happen again. I appreciate that he was frank to share, but I doubt it could be a valve leh. I think he kenah smoked by his engineer.

EPS generally uses a steering motor to assist steering. It gets information from the torque sensor and the ECU for the condition and to assist appropriately. Example, if you are stationary, it will give maximum assistance. But if the ECU tell the motor that the car is travelling at speed, it will assist with less power. So I dun think its got to do with a valve, as that indicates a hydraulic assist. Correct me if I'm wrong.

But could it be and does anybody know whether its because different batch/capacity use different power steering system? I read somewhere that the overseas LX version uses hydraulic power steering.

Where I read tat Forte top-line LX uses traditional hydraulic power steering(HPS).

What did impress was the electric power steering system. EPS technology was a reluctant sacrifice, until recently. It yielded at least an extra 1 mpg, but tended to numb out a car’s steering. The latest systems are much improved. In another review, on TheDetroitBureau.com, you’ll find us singing the praises of the electric steering on Chevrolet’s new Equinox. While the system on the 2010 Kia Forte isn’t quite as good, it maintains a reasonable sense of road feel and actually seemed a bit more precise than the traditional hydraulic power steering on the top-line Forte LX was also drove.

- http://www.thedetroitbureau.com/2009/06/first-drive-2010-kia-forte/


I think there is a different experience with an HPS losing assistance and an EPS losing assistance. For HPS, I think it could be much easier to steer w/o resistance than cars with EPS losing assitance.

our current local EX also using the Hyd assisted power steering....

FriesL wrote:Yup.. EX comes with hydraulic steering.. no too worry, here it seems if car not start for a prolong period.. the module cut off the power supply to steering... to conserve power.. (i think for most modern car will be using motor / wire drive liao)

but i do concern if no assisted power (as specs indicated) could we turn / steer the car.. (just like hydraulic.. we could still do tat..)..

anyone? Thanks in advance..
else i post up when i got my ride.. in 2 weeks time. (i hope and finger cross...)

As Friesl bro pointed out, EX comes with hydraulic steering, so maybe only the SX comes with EPS? Dunno whether it is a good or bad thing. Mostly, the advantages of the EPS as mentioned below:

One of the advantages of electric power steering is that it eliminates the power steering pump, which can use as much as 8 to 10 horsepower under load. This improves fuel economy while also eliminating the weight and bulk of the power steering pump and hoses. Getting rid of the hydraulics also does away with fluid leaks and the need to check the power steering fluid.

- http://www.aa1car.com/library/steering_power_electric.htm

So far, fellow Forte owners with the same prob with me (very stiff/locked-up steering at moving off) are driving the 1.6 SX (A) which comes with EPS. So maybe its something to take note.

Hi, bro duncton
was confirmed by SE that EX comes with hydraulic steering.

probably its seems the down down side of EPS is the missing road feel. not the technology, thus users really dun like it.

but what concern me is the ability to steer without power assist and that is very very important. think its super heavy maybe we need to drive thru all the gears and the motor it self..

now comes to mind is to verify if bro Fortec is driving a SX model (EPS)...

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u champion wahaha by switching off ur car u are also disabling ur brake pump and ur ABS wowow my hero.......

FriesL wrote:
......

now comes to mind is to verify if bro Fortec is driving a SX model (EPS)...

Bro Fortec is drving 1.6 SX (M) bah.... Thats according to the registration. So he might be using EPS too.

Hmm... Please hor ... other drivers, do not try what bro Fortec did. Can be quite dangerous if you are not sure of what you are in fact disabling in yur car. Need to say that really really appreciate the experiment, he proved that it could still be handled.... with due force.

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u champion wahaha by switching off ur car u are also disabling ur brake pump and ur ABS wowow my hero.......

The brake works even if the engine is off.
ABS, need ABS for????

Fortec wrote:

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u champion wahaha by switching off ur car u are also disabling ur brake pump and ur ABS wowow my hero.......

The brake works even if the engine is off.
ABS, need ABS for????

hmm its works? try pumping ur brakes for a few times with engine off then u will get wat i mean =)

Something as important as steering the direction of the car, if you are a designer/engineer...what is the logical feature you would implement should the primary hydraulic/electronic assisted steering system fail?

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u champion wahaha by switching off ur car u are also disabling ur brake pump and ur ABS wowow my hero.......

The brake works even if the engine is off.
ABS, need ABS for????

hmm its works? try pumping ur brakes for a few times with engine off then u will get wat i mean =)

Oh then my car should end up kissing someone backside last night liao...

Fortec wrote:

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u champion wahaha by switching off ur car u are also disabling ur brake pump and ur ABS wowow my hero.......

The brake works even if the engine is off.
ABS, need ABS for????

hmm its works? try pumping ur brakes for a few times with engine off then u will get wat i mean =)

Oh then my car should end up kissing someone backside last night liao...

hmmm thats weird cos when i pump up mine in off mod the brakes get harder and harder to step...(can others comfirm this or is this only me?)

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:

Divine wrote:

Fortec wrote:Switched off the car when coming down from Lido Carpark last night level 10. The natural gradient of the CP allows me to juz glide it down all the way to the gantry.

Steering is as per non assisted steering, hard n heavy.

wow bro u champion wahaha by switching off ur car u are also disabling ur brake pump and ur ABS wowow my hero.......

The brake works even if the engine is off.
ABS, need ABS for????

hmm its works? try pumping ur brakes for a few times with engine off then u will get wat i mean =)

Oh then my car should end up kissing someone backside last night liao...

hmmm thats weird cos when i pump up mine in off mod the brakes get harder and harder to step...(can others comfirm this or is this only me?)

Yes it get harder and harder to step coz the engine is not doing the vacuuming job liao...that doesn't means the brakes are not working. The vacuum or brake pump/booster u called it...is juz like an assist to make things easier. Just that you have to use more force on the pedals once the vaccum effects are gone.

wooot ... ok actually tat was wat i meant to say... pai seh misunderstanding=x.

Woo.. thanks duncton!
haa.... this is important.. should try to see my confident in doing that... when i get my ride (hopefully wont break anyparts..haaa... )...

FriesL wrote:Woo.. thanks duncton!
haa.... this is important.. should try to see my confident in doing that... when i get my ride (hopefully wont break anyparts..haaa... )...

Don't try it on steep gradient hor....ur legs no power don't blame me haha....(have ur hand brake on the ready).
Best just do whatever u are most comfy with.